From robhawley at earthlink.net Wed Feb 8 16:31:47 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Insurance Estimate for Site Message-ID: The insurance company responded that the estimated cost of the insurance was $400 per year. This assumed that we had all "subscribers" sign the liability waiver. Rob Hawley From robhawley at earthlink.net Wed Feb 8 16:33:59 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site Message-ID: At the last meeting we decided that we would put a note on the site in the March Ephemeris. At this point A) I can go ahead and submit an article B) We can ask the editor to delay the deadline until after Saturday C) We can postpone submitting the article Please advise which course of action the board prefers. Rob Hawley From craigus at rocketmail.com Wed Feb 8 20:04:10 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site/ status report In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20060209040410.46095.qmail@web53805.mail.yahoo.com> We've made great progress (thanks mainly to Rob). However, I would prefer that we postpone the announcement a month. I would feel comfortable releasing this once we have reviewed a preliminary use plan and insurance terms by Bob Ayers for an initial round of feedback/discussion. **Next steps on critical path to accepting donation** Rob can you take a first pass at a use plan? This is on the critical path because SJAA and Bob need to agree on the terms. The subscriber model is an important sub-component of the use plan. We may need time to digest the terms that accompany the insurance quote to ensure that both SJAA and Bob are comfortable with the coverage, its limitations and the necessary waiver we will require subscribers to sign. Need to verify easement policy. Bob states that every owner has an easement allowing them to travel all the roads that are shown on the topo map. Need to verify CC&Rs. Bob states that no motorcycles are allowed and that the owner does not have mineral rights. **Next steps, less important** It sounds like we will not know our possible tax-exempt status until we apply, but my understanding is that the outcome is not going to block the donation. I can continue my (slow) investigation of septic and clivus systems. This is not on the critical path because I am confident we can figure something out. We will visit the site at night when moon/weather permits. This is not on the critical path because Bob, Rob, myself, Lee and Kevin all have some observing experience with the area and it's near surroundings. Mike has requested that we develop a "long term plan" for the site so that any short term decisions do not preclude future opportunities. This is important, but not critical right now -- with the exception of our ability to maintain 501c3 status which keeps the doors open for the possibility of a future Group 70 co-location on the site. cheers Craig --- Rob Hawley wrote: > At the last meeting we decided that we would put a note > on the site in the > March Ephemeris. At this point > > A) I can go ahead and submit an article > B) We can ask the editor to delay the deadline until > after Saturday > C) We can postpone submitting the article > > Please advise which course of action the board prefers. > > > Rob Hawley > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From robhawley at earthlink.net Wed Feb 8 20:22:57 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site/ status report In-Reply-To: <20060209040410.46095.qmail@web53805.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Works for me. That is why I asked. Rob Hawley From koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net Wed Feb 8 20:28:40 2006 From: koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net (Michael Koop) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site/ status report In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060208212615.U13315@koopm.best.vwh.net> One small wrinkle, you might want to delay until May. We have the auction in April, therfore no general meeting. Another possiblilty is to announce at the March meeting. Mike On Wed, 8 Feb 2006, Rob Hawley wrote: > Works for me. That is why I asked. > > > Rob Hawley > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From craigus at rocketmail.com Wed Feb 8 20:50:07 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site/ status report In-Reply-To: <20060208212615.U13315@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: <20060209045007.77582.qmail@web53803.mail.yahoo.com> OK --- Michael Koop wrote: > One small wrinkle, you might want to delay until May. > We have the auction in April, therfore no general > meeting. > Another possiblilty is to announce at the March > meeting. > > > Mike > > On Wed, 8 Feb 2006, Rob Hawley wrote: > > > Works for me. That is why I asked. > > > > > > Rob Hawley > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > SJAABoard mailing list > > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From wb6yru at aenet.net Thu Feb 9 02:59:41 2006 From: wb6yru at aenet.net (Gary Mitchell) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Insurance Estimate for Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <43EB209D.10400@aenet.net> Rob Hawley wrote: > The insurance company responded that the estimated cost of the insurance was > $400 per year. This assumed that we had all "subscribers" sign the liability > waiver. Is that considered a stand-alone liability insurance, or simply added to our existing policy? (I assume you told them this site wouldn't be open to the public, except by invitation.) It would be interesting to see what it'd be if Group 70 had an observatory there. Gary From wb6yru at aenet.net Thu Feb 9 03:25:01 2006 From: wb6yru at aenet.net (Gary Mitchell) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> Rob Hawley wrote: > At the last meeting we decided that we would put a note on the site in the > March Ephemeris. At this point > > A) I can go ahead and submit an article > B) We can ask the editor to delay the deadline until after Saturday > C) We can postpone submitting the article > > Please advise which course of action the board prefers. Why not let the club know that a possible site finally might be within our reach? It could attract members who would be able to help out. Does Bob care about keeping this deal a secret? If not, then why it's so important that we continue to keep our mouth(s) shut? So what if every 'i' isn't yet dotted and 't' crossed. Now, I'm not saying go nuts bragging about it, but at the same time I think we're being too overly cautious keeping it under wraps. Gary From robhawley at earthlink.net Thu Feb 9 06:58:12 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> Message-ID: Let's talk about this at the board meeting. This is the list of information we need before we can make a final vote. Investigate CC&Rs and Easements Ownership Economics Evaluate nighttime light domes Input from Selected members Obtain Cost Estimate on Septic System (complete)Obtain Liability Insurance Costs Decide on "Subscriber" Model Implications on Real Estate Taxes Agree on Use Plan with Donor We do (I do) need input from the membership before you can make a decision. I would prefer that being sooner rather than later. Mike's suggestion is a compromise that we verbally announce it in March and put the article in the April Ephemeris. Rob Hawley From craigus at rocketmail.com Thu Feb 9 08:31:06 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> Message-ID: <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> Bob does not require this deal to be secret, but when I mentioned that we would be doing an announcement to the club he commented that we were entirely too confident and that a good number of issues still needed to be resolved first. He didn't say this in a pessimistic way, just objectively speaking. My understanding of the issues-to-be-resolved were listed in the "critical path" section of my previous email. --- Gary Mitchell wrote: > Rob Hawley wrote: > > > At the last meeting we decided that we would put a > note on the site in the > > March Ephemeris. At this point > > > > A) I can go ahead and submit an article > > B) We can ask the editor to delay the deadline until > after Saturday > > C) We can postpone submitting the article > > > > Please advise which course of action the board > prefers. > > Why not let the club know that a possible site finally > might be within our reach? It could attract members > who > would be able to help out. > > Does Bob care about keeping this deal a secret? If > not, > then why it's so important that we continue to keep our > mouth(s) shut? So what if every 'i' isn't yet dotted > and 't' crossed. Now, I'm not saying go nuts bragging > about it, but at the same time I think we're being too > overly cautious keeping it under wraps. > > Gary > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From akkana at shallowsky.com Thu Feb 9 09:37:22 2006 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> References: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> Craig Scull writes: > Bob does not require this deal to be secret, but when I > mentioned that we would be doing an announcement to the > club he commented that we were entirely too confident and > that a good number of issues still needed to be resolved It's probably too early to announce anything as a "done deal". But don't club members deserve to know something is being discussed, especially if you're already coming up with plans like the "subscriber model" mentioned in a previous message? Maybe there are members with experience that could be helpful in resolving the issues, if they just knew something was going on. It seems strange how this is all being done so secretly with no opportunity for most of the membership to know about it or offer any input. Do you like it when a government agency makes decisions on what to do with your money behind closed doors? Or do you prefer it when they have public announcements and meetings during the process? Is the SJAA any different? ...Akkana From jvn at svpal.org Thu Feb 9 11:06:15 2006 From: jvn at svpal.org (Jim Van Nuland) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site References: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <43EB92A7.74D0@svpal.org> Akkana Peck wrote: > Maybe there are members with experience that could be helpful in > resolving the issues, if they just knew something was going on. HEAR! HEAR! -- Jim Van Nuland, San Jose (California) Astronomical Association JVN's web site From craigus at rocketmail.com Thu Feb 9 13:55:07 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <20060209215508.35203.qmail@web53809.mail.yahoo.com> I completely agree with you. However, I'm trying to do or not do (as the case may be), whatever is necessary to ensure smooth relations with our donor. I know some may say my priorities should be reversed, ensure membership involvement and satisfaction first, but I don't share that view at this early point in time. Let me give you an example of how misinformation spread and what the consequences were. Some unofficial members of Group 70 had discussions with several people (3 to be exact that I know personally) in years past about the possible donation and/or use of land for the group 70 telescope. The 3 potential donors all have told me that they got a very negative (terrible) impression of Group 70 at the time and 2 of the 3 said they have absolutely no interest in working with Group 70 ever again as a result of those interactions. Timewise I could not invest the time necessary for damage control necessary should something like this happen to us. I also don't have the time to work with more people than I'm working with right now. My main contribution to the project is to be the single voice of SJAA to Bob Ayers, and to provide feedback to all the great work Rob is doing and contribute my perspective where it might help. So here are my suggested solutions--- **Model 1 - Communication Liason** We don't really have anyone in the role of communicating to the broader club to introduce the situation, inviting discussion, and aggregating any feedback back to the observatory committee. Perhaps this is something that you would be willing to take up? It's entirely possible that we'd have only 2.5 people interested in learning more/contributing to the discussion. I agree we might learn something that we've overlooked or otherwise get help. **Model 2 - Pizza** I see no reason why we couldn't have a friendly conversation over some pizza to talk about this as a group working session with whomever wanted to join us. For example, group 70 gets together once a month over pizza to talk about their project and all are welcome to join. Why don't we have the SJAA observatory committee meet once a month for a working session that is open to whomever in SJAA wants to participate. The first session might be a Q/A after Rob gives his overview presentation (I could do this Rob, if you need a break). I think this could be a fun/productive way to invite SJAA'ers to the "table" (literally). The "Pizza" model is my preferred direction if Gary, Rob, Mike, Yourself would be up for it. --- Akkana Peck wrote: > Craig Scull writes: > > Bob does not require this deal to be secret, but when > I > > mentioned that we would be doing an announcement to > the > > club he commented that we were entirely too confident > and > > that a good number of issues still needed to be > resolved > > It's probably too early to announce anything as a "done > deal". > But don't club members deserve to know something is > being discussed, > especially if you're already coming up with plans like > the > "subscriber model" mentioned in a previous message? > > Maybe there are members with experience that could be > helpful in > resolving the issues, if they just knew something was > going on. > > It seems strange how this is all being done so secretly > with > no opportunity for most of the membership to know about > it > or offer any input. Do you like it when a government > agency > makes decisions on what to do with your money behind > closed doors? > Or do you prefer it when they have public announcements > and > meetings during the process? Is the SJAA any > different? > > ...Akkana > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net Thu Feb 9 15:46:58 2006 From: koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net (Michael Koop) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> References: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <20060209164211.P8992@koopm.best.vwh.net> Let me make one thing perfectly clear.....;-) Unlike congress, where public money is being spent, we are trying to get a donation from a private individual. The donation offer was made on the spur of the moment thought at our December meeting. To assist getting the donation, I have appointed Craig Scull the chairman of the Observatory Committee and the single point contact with the donor. We had a problem with one of the other committee members asking inappropriate questions to the donor which forced the appointment of a single point of contact. ( In defense of the person who asked the questions, they needed to be asked, but the timing was wrong. You dont ask for a prenuptial agreement on the first date!) How we get the donation is really not open to public debate. You know as well as I, that email is an impersonal way of communicating. Things are quickly taken out of context and one misunderstood comment may risk the donation. Before we make any public announcement, I have asked the Observatory Committee to get a written Memorandum of Agreement. This document is what we will use to transfer the land. The purpose of the document is to make sure we use the land as it is intended in the donation and prevent the board being sued by the donor. The observatory committee is responsible for generating this document and working with the donor to get it done. I expect this document will talk in general terms, with no real specifics. For example, the SJAA will charge what is appropriate to have the observatory be self sustaining and not be a money maker for the club. Once the agreement is ready from the perspective of the observatory committee and the donor, we need a lawyer for the SJAA look it over. The donor should have his own lawyer approve it also since we may have Quid Pro Quo issues with the donation. Once the agreement document is ready, we make a formal public announcement and post the details of the site and the agreement. We will have a dedicated SJAA open meeting for members to go over the details before the club signs it. This allows the other members of the SJAA to have their inputs considered. It is possible that other members will catch something that the observatory committee has not, but I do not expect any real changes to be made here since Craig, Rob, and Gary have been very thorough. If we announce before this document is done, I feel we will have "too many cooks" which might jeopardize or delay the donation. This is also our last opportunity to decline the donation. This will have major impact on how the club is run and may stretch our limited resources. Our hope is that the active observers in the Bay Area will join us in using and supporting (monetarily/work party/ect.) the site. I hope this has explained all this secrecy. Actually, it is not secret at all since it has been noted in the board meeting minutes for December and January. In addition, it has been less than 60 days since we have been notified of the possible donation. The board of directors is satisfied with the progress of the observatory committee. If you have any concerns, you are encouraged to come to this Saturday's board meeting and voice them. We also have the general election at the February meeting if you would like to join the board. Mike On Thu, 9 Feb 2006, Akkana Peck wrote: > Craig Scull writes: >> Bob does not require this deal to be secret, but when I >> mentioned that we would be doing an announcement to the >> club he commented that we were entirely too confident and >> that a good number of issues still needed to be resolved > > It's probably too early to announce anything as a "done deal". > But don't club members deserve to know something is being discussed, > especially if you're already coming up with plans like the > "subscriber model" mentioned in a previous message? > > Maybe there are members with experience that could be helpful in > resolving the issues, if they just knew something was going on. > > It seems strange how this is all being done so secretly with > no opportunity for most of the membership to know about it > or offer any input. Do you like it when a government agency > makes decisions on what to do with your money behind closed doors? > Or do you prefer it when they have public announcements and > meetings during the process? Is the SJAA any different? > > ...Akkana > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From robhawley at earthlink.net Thu Feb 9 18:03:42 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <20060209164211.P8992@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: Just to be clear with everyone my vote in favor of accepting the donation is not assured despite being one of the principles working on this. It will not be unless I know that the property will be used. I am also closely looking at whether or not the SJAA organization will be able to manage the property. Thus it looks like I fall in the middle of the road on this topic. Unlike most of the issues the board handles this issue involves real money and could evaporate if the donor changes his mind. The board has a number of legal and fiduciary duties that it has not been previously called on to perform. I was an early advocate of complete secrecy on this topic; however, one of the necessary parts of the board's go decision is to insure there is a community of users that will actually become subscribers and use this property. These potential users may not be current SJAA members. For example, the imagers are currently thinking about going to the Carrizo Plain in search of dark skies. We cannot determine if there is a market unless we ask people. I believe we need to solicit input sooner rather than later. We have already approached one non-SJAA member for input. Using this mail list is one form of soliciting input of non-board members. I do not think standing up and announcing the donation at a public meeting is currently appropriate. I agree with Bob that there is still too much we do not know at this time. We have changed the details of the proposal several times in the last two months. We are only beginning to understand the economics of ownership. It is likely we will have to ask for donations to fund some capital development that will be required to use the site. Once we make a general public announcement we will make an impression that will be difficult to change. We need to be sure that the benefits and risks are accurately known and presented. There will be two new SJAA board members starting Saturday. One of these is familiar with the site. I would like to see the board approach others for their input, but I would like to keep these contacts discreet and with people that will understand the early phase of this evaluation. Rob Hawley FYI to Akkana The "subscriber" model is being driven by our interpretation of the legal requirements of the laws involving the real estate exemption (unfortunately known as the "Welfare Exemption"). If you are interested I can forward you information on this; however the best analysis is an email from Dave North. I suggest you ask him. From wb6yru at aenet.net Fri Feb 10 04:15:42 2006 From: wb6yru at aenet.net (Gary Mitchell) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Ephemeris Article on Site In-Reply-To: <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> References: <43EB268D.40901@aenet.net> <20060209163107.79171.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> <20060209173722.GA11219@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <43EC83EE.5030800@aenet.net> Akkana Peck wrote: > Craig Scull writes: > >>Bob does not require this deal to be secret, but when I >>mentioned that we would be doing an announcement to the >>club he commented that we were entirely too confident and >>that a good number of issues still needed to be resolved > > > It's probably too early to announce anything as a "done deal". > But don't club members deserve to know something is being discussed, > especially if you're already coming up with plans like the > "subscriber model" mentioned in a previous message? > > Maybe there are members with experience that could be helpful in > resolving the issues, if they just knew something was going on. > > It seems strange how this is all being done so secretly with > no opportunity for most of the membership to know about it > or offer any input. Do you like it when a government agency > makes decisions on what to do with your money behind closed doors? > Or do you prefer it when they have public announcements and > meetings during the process? Is the SJAA any different? > > ...Akkana That's basically what I was trying to say, but you said it better. :) I have been one of the *very* few "on the inside." As things progressed, I have not resigned completely, but have assumed a more minor roll. (For a variety of reasons, the secrecy aspect being one.) This is not meant to sound sinister in any way, but for a supposedly open club, there are surprisingly few people calling all the shots in relative secrecy... so far. The way I see it, there are two sides to this: It's very hard to get people to volunteer to do things in clubs. Here we have a couple of people who have really rolled up their sleeves and are handling this, and it's not a minor task. On the other hand, in my opinion, they've been hanging on too tightly; that is, being a little bit too dictatorial and secretive. It's probably very hard to get one without the other. I will say this: I've already seen some of the research (legal etc) that Craig and especially Rob has already done. It's impressive and thorough. I'd be surprised if they miss something important. So, to the rest of the board: I agree these guys need to loosen up a bit, but the club needs to appreciate all the work, effort, and care they're putting in to it. This land deal may not have popped up on the club's radar yet, but neither has all their effort. Gary From robhawley at earthlink.net Fri Feb 10 08:47:41 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Briefing for non-board members Message-ID: I plan to bring the briefing material to the next board meeting on Saturday. Craig and I will provide an update during the board meeting. As time allows I can answer questions on what we currently know and do not know, but the information on the mail list has been a pretty good summary. I can stay after the general meeting to answer more questions. I agree with Mike and Craig that this is not a done deal as far as the donor and it is premature to give a full presentation to the membership at this point. Please make me aware of any members with legal experience. I have some contacts that I have used in the past to obtain pro-bono legal help for another club. If we have club members that have the appropriate legal experience then we can approach them. We will be nominating a new board member Saturday that has a great deal of experience evaluating astronomical properties and who was interesting in purchasing this property. Rob Hawley From robhawley at earthlink.net Fri Feb 10 10:24:47 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Feb membership counts Message-ID: 10 paid members (3 from 2005, 4 from 2004 ) did not renew in January. I was late getting out the past due reminders so we may yet pick up some of these. Current counts 321 total 292 paid 29 complementary 5 new since last meeting **************************************************************************** ************* Expiration Histogram How many membership expire in each month Dec-05 3 Jan-06 11 Feb-06 11 Mar-06 17 Apr-06 14 May-06 23 Jun-06 62 Jul-06 18 Aug-06 26 Sep-06 23 Oct-06 19 Nov-06 17 Dec-06 19 Jan-07 18 Feb-07 13 Mar-07 4 more than 13 months 8 complementary 29 expiring 14 paid(current) 292 email delivery 13 Labels Generated 322 S&T Members 182 New Members since last meeting 5 current + complementary 321 **************************************************************************** *************** Length of Membership Number of current paid members that joined each year paid only 2006 7 2005 61 2004 48 2003 39 2002 19 2001 9 2000 1 < 2000 58 Specified 235 80% Not Specified 57 total 292 **************************************************************************** ******************* Which members did not renew For members that did not renew this is the year that they joined. Only members whose membership expired in the last year are considered. expired (not including ex-compl) 2006 0 2005 3 2004 26 2003 10 2002 5 2001 0 2000 0 < 2000 1 Specified 45 83% Not Specified 9 total 54 Rob Hawley From koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net Fri Feb 10 17:01:06 2006 From: koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net (Michael Koop) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Yosemite Dates Set Message-ID: <20060210175856.E41115@koopm.best.vwh.net> The SJAA date for the Yosemite Star Party is July 21-22. All other dates are listed here: http://aanc-astronomy.org/yosemite.html Jim, are you continuing to run the Yosemite Star Party or would you like someone else to take over? Mike From jvn at svpal.org Fri Feb 10 18:00:10 2006 From: jvn at svpal.org (Jim Van Nuland) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Yosemite Dates Set References: <20060210175856.E41115@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: <43ED452A.2F40@svpal.org> Michael Koop wrote: > > The SJAA date for the Yosemite Star Party is July 21-22. > All other dates are listed here: > http://aanc-astronomy.org/yosemite.html Sheesh! I just now get the date, and already I have a bunch of people standing in line! I myself am 9th in my list! BTW -- the posted list has the wrong e-address for me -- It's Jay VEE En, not Jay YOU en. Curiously, Dave has the correct address in the "To:" field. > Jim, are you continuing to run the Yosemite Star Party or would > you like someone else to take over? No -- I've been getting my first choice of dates, so I'll continue to take credit for it a while more. Someone else may have a slower post office. -- Jim Van Nuland, San Jose (California) Astronomical Association JVN's web site From craigus at rocketmail.com Sat Feb 11 14:05:49 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Note for Gordon Reade In-Reply-To: <20060209164211.P8992@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: <20060211220549.75347.qmail@web53807.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Gordon I just got a call from Gautam Rao. His high school astronomy club has finally been "approved." Now that it's active, he would like to know if your offer is still open to stop by and do a lunch-time solar observing visit. You can reach Gautam at: fcbayer@gmail.com I don't have a personal email for you so I am using this list in the hopes that you are subscribed. The SJAA Officers page lists no_email_yet@best.com as your email address. I assume this is a placeholder for a real address. cheers Craig ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From jvn at svpal.org Sat Feb 11 17:30:12 2006 From: jvn at svpal.org (Jim Van Nuland) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Tardy Message-ID: <43EE8FA4.4FCE@svpal.org> Hi, All, Unexpected house guest just dropped in. I may be late for the board meeting, but should be there by 6:30. -- Jim Van Nuland, San Jose (California) Astronomical Association JVN's web site From rnapo at znet.com Mon Feb 13 17:16:31 2006 From: rnapo at znet.com (Rich N) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Sky Publishing sold... References: <20060210175856.E41115@koopm.best.vwh.net> <43ED452A.2F40@svpal.org> Message-ID: <001901c63104$4a8a84e0$f8f71345@180edt> Hi folks, I just read on the Cloudy Nights Forum that Sky Publishing has been sold. "As of today, Sky Publishing, Publishers of Sky & Telescope magazine, is owned by New Track Media & Boston Ventures." by BillC Rich From rnapo at znet.com Tue Feb 14 10:43:39 2006 From: rnapo at znet.com (Rich N) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] I put a note on CN about our Messier Marathon References: <20060208212615.U13315@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: <002c01c63196$92c29940$77f61345@180edt> Hi folks, The other day I put a note about the SJAA Messier Marathon on the star party section of the Cloudy Nights Forum. There are CN readers in Northern California. http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/821825/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/1 Clear skies, Rich From koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net Wed Feb 15 00:31:43 2006 From: koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net (Michael Koop) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Sky Quality Meter group purchase proposal Message-ID: <20060215012920.L64766@koopm.best.vwh.net> Should we buy one or two for the club? Might be interesting, but I am not too impressed by it since it does not have a computer interface. Much more useful if you could track over large periods of time. Mike ******************************** Hi all, Below is a copy of a message I posted to TAC a couple of days ago. Sorry for the duplication, but maybe there are a few here who didn't see the TAC message. I have 6 orders so far, which brings the price down from $120 to $105. If I can get 4 more, the price will drop again to $90 (plus S&H). Let me know if you are interested. Bob J. ---------------------------------------------------------- I was about to order a Sky Quality Meter, when I noticed that there is a price break for ordering 5 or more. If you don't know what it is, see: http://unihedron.com/projects/darksky/ They are $120 each (plus S&H), but $105 each (plus S&H) for 5 or more. So we'd save at least $15 each by ordering in quantity (possibly more, since S&H probably isn't linear). If you are interested, please email me back (off list, of course!). Bob J. _______________________________________________ CalAstro mailing list CalAstro@six.pairlist.net http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/calastro From pkohlmil at best.com Wed Feb 15 01:04:45 2006 From: pkohlmil at best.com (Paul Kohlmiller) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] March Ephemeris Message-ID: <001001c6320e$dff823b0$0800a8c0@PKHPXPP> The March issue of the Ephemeris is ready to be proofread at: http://ephemeris.sjaa.net/0603/EphMar06.pdf The picture on page 5 needs better contrast which I can fix. But I could use a caption and "courtesy of" notation. I amended the officer's list on the next-to-the-last page but please check my spelling. I could use phone numbers for the 2 new officers and for Gordon Reade. I need to fix the web site also which means I'll need e-mails and pictures unless I have them already. The Ephemeris is 12 pages long this time because we just had too much good stuff. All comments and suggestions welcome but especially the corrections. This issue will go to the printer's early Friday morning. Thank you, Paul and Mary Kohlmiller -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.sjaa.net/pipermail/sjaaboard/attachments/20060215/cbc0d001/attachment.html From craigus at rocketmail.com Wed Feb 15 01:10:26 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Jan 14, 2006 - Final SJAA Board Meeting Minutes Message-ID: <20060215091026.26858.qmail@web53806.mail.yahoo.com> ============================================== Jan 14, 2006 - SJAA Board Meeting Minutes - Craig Scull ============================================== For all meeting minutes Craig will print out one copy of the last month???s minutes for the upcoming board meeting and send out a final edited version the next day. --------------------- Board Members Present --------------------- Gary Mitchell Craig Scull Dave Smith (excused) Dana Crom (not excused) Rob Hawley Bill O???Schaughnessy Gordon Reade Mike Koop (excused) Jim Van Nuland --------------- Meeting minutes --------------- Minutes were approved from the last meeting. Bill passed a motion to approve the minutes, the motion was seconded and approved by the rest of the board members present with no abstentions. ---------------------- Treasury Report (Gary) ---------------------- As planned, our 6 month CD has expired and I transferred it to a 1 year CD. The interest brought it up to $5076.34 Now the general fund has two 1-year CDs that are 6 months apart (one expires early July 2006, the other January 2007). If the check book gets significantly more than $5000, we can consider getting another $5000 CD and start it at a quarterly boundary (early April or October). (For those who need a refresher... We put our observatory fund and part of the general fund into certificates of deposit for a better interest rate.) The check book currently shows $5066.20. There's another $309.65 currently in our PayPal account that I haven't yet transferred over, so for all intents and purposes, the check book is now at $5375.85. I have renewed our IDA membership (International Dark-Sky Association). I paid our bulk mail annual fee and added $500 to our Bulk mail account. With what's already in there, we should now have more than enough for mailing the Ephemeris for 2006. ---------------------------------------------- Membership Report (Rob) ---------------------------------------------- I total of 64 people joined SJAA in 2005. That has to be balanced with 47 people who did not renew their memberships. The net gain reversed the trend of 2004. The current totals stand at 298 paid, 30 complementary, total of 328. I inadvertently included the link to www.sjaa.net/gotstars in the Merc advert for Friday's star party. This time they published the link instead of truncating it. So that meant I had to update gotstars and keep it alive. ---------------------------------- Loaner Scope Program Report (Mike) ---------------------------------- No updates. Mike was not present. ------------------------------------------- Observational Astronomy Class Report (Mike) ------------------------------------------- No updates. Mike was not present. ---------------- ATM Class (Mike) ---------------- No updates. Mike was not present. ------------------------------- General Meeting Programs (Mike) ------------------------------- No updates. Mike was not present. --------------------------- Observatory Committee --------------------------- PPT Slide presentation given by Rob to provide overview of the land that has been offered to the club. We need to confirm that we have adequate right of way easements for the property. We are investigating to see if our membership model would qualify for a property tax exemption. We will organize a visit on January 28th to visit the property. We will announce in the March Ephemeris that we are evaluating a possible land donation. Group 70 The board agrees that Group 70 was contacted too early. The board has not decided whether to approve the donation or not. We (mostly Craig and myself) are really busy just with evaluating the donation. Neither of us has the time to conduct a detailed discussion with Group 70 for land that we may or may not eventually own. Craig or Rob to present at 1/25 Group 70 meeting. Meeting will be for information purposes only. "We cannot negotiate a MOA right now because of bandwidth issues." Agreement is to continue investigating the site. ---------------------------- Star Party Updates ---------------------------- School star part report follows. Three on the schedule in January, one more probable. One was cancelled due to scheduling problem at school. Six in February, plus make-up(s) if there are cloud-outs. Nine in March, but this will fill up to 15 or 20. -------------- Calendar (Mike) -------------- No updates. Mike was not present. ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From robhawley at earthlink.net Wed Feb 15 08:13:19 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Sky Quality Meter group purchase proposal In-Reply-To: <20060215012920.L64766@koopm.best.vwh.net> Message-ID: I am OK with that proposal. Rob Hawley > -----Original Message----- > From: sjaaboard-bounces@sjaa.net > [mailto:sjaaboard-bounces@sjaa.net] On Behalf Of Michael Koop > Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 12:32 AM > To: sjaaboard@sjaa.net > Subject: [SJAABoard] Sky Quality Meter group purchase proposal > > Should we buy one or two for the club? > Might be interesting, but I am not too impressed by it since > it does not have a computer interface. Much more useful if > you could track over large periods of time. > > Mike > > ******************************** > > Hi all, > > Below is a copy of a message I posted to TAC a couple of days ago. > Sorry for the duplication, but maybe there are a few here who > didn't see the TAC message. > > I have 6 orders so far, which brings the price down from $120 to $105. > If I can get 4 more, the price will drop again to $90 (plus > S&H). Let me know if you are interested. > > Bob J. > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > I was about to order a Sky Quality Meter, when I noticed that > there is a price break for ordering 5 or more. If you don't > know what it is, > see: > > http://unihedron.com/projects/darksky/ > > They are $120 each (plus S&H), but $105 each (plus S&H) for 5 or more. > So we'd save at least $15 each by ordering in quantity > (possibly more, since S&H probably isn't linear). > > If you are interested, please email me back (off list, of course!). > > Bob J. > _______________________________________________ > CalAstro mailing list > CalAstro@six.pairlist.net > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/calastro > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net Wed Feb 15 14:15:15 2006 From: koopm at koopm.best.vwh.net (Michael Koop) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] March Ephemeris In-Reply-To: <001001c6320e$dff823b0$0800a8c0@PKHPXPP> References: <001001c6320e$dff823b0$0800a8c0@PKHPXPP> Message-ID: <20060215151204.G74018@koopm.best.vwh.net> Great issue...... The picture is from the Genesis Campaign. Here is the group photo we took the day of the test flight with the DC8 in the background. I do not know why Jim was not in the picure! http://reentry.arc.nasa.gov/imagesstardust/ACD06-0002-001.jpg I have a few rewording to send on a few articles. I'll try to get to them tonight. Mike "Armageddon" Koop On Wed, 15 Feb 2006, Paul Kohlmiller wrote: > The March issue of the Ephemeris is ready to be proofread at: > http://ephemeris.sjaa.net/0603/EphMar06.pdf > > The picture on page 5 needs better contrast which I can fix. But I could use a caption and "courtesy of" notation. I amended the officer's list on the next-to-the-last page but please check my spelling. I could use phone numbers for the 2 new officers and for Gordon Reade. I need to fix the web site also which means I'll need e-mails and pictures unless I have them already. > > The Ephemeris is 12 pages long this time because we just had too much good stuff. > > All comments and suggestions welcome but especially the corrections. This issue will go to the printer's early Friday morning. > > Thank you, > Paul and Mary Kohlmiller > From craigus at rocketmail.com Wed Feb 22 21:29:48 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday Message-ID: <20060223052948.55595.qmail@web53809.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings, You are invited to observe with me this friday at Bob Ayers land. The purpose of the visit is to assess the light domes, the potential near sources of light, to otherwise give the site a "test run" and have a good time under the stars. I'm also going to find out how easy/difficult the road is to manage in a front wheel drive VW stationwagon. We will meet at Houge Park at 3pm and leave by 3:15. Please let me know in advance if you would like to join me. Why Friday? Bob has other obligations on Saturday that prevent him from being able to observe. cheers Craig ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From rnapo at znet.com Wed Feb 22 21:33:53 2006 From: rnapo at znet.com (Rich N) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday References: <20060223052948.55595.qmail@web53809.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001b01c6383a$bc95a460$92f71345@180edt> Thanks Craig, but I'm planning on supporting our Houge Park Public star party this Friday. Maybe you folks can come up with another time that doesn't conflict with our public star party. Rich > Greetings, > > You are invited to observe with me this friday at Bob > Ayers land. The purpose of the visit is to assess the > light domes, the potential near sources of light, to > otherwise give the site a "test run" and have a good time > under the stars. I'm also going to find out how > easy/difficult the road is to manage in a front wheel > drive VW stationwagon. > > We will meet at Houge Park at 3pm and leave by 3:15. > > Please let me know in advance if you would like to join > me. > > Why Friday? Bob has other obligations on Saturday that > prevent him from being able to observe. > > cheers > Craig > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. > www.greatvaluestores.com > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From robhawley at earthlink.net Thu Feb 23 08:11:10 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday In-Reply-To: <001b01c6383a$bc95a460$92f71345@180edt> Message-ID: The star party was last week. Rob Hawley > -----Original Message----- > From: sjaaboard-bounces@sjaa.net > [mailto:sjaaboard-bounces@sjaa.net] On Behalf Of Rich N > Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 9:34 PM > To: Business list for SJAA board of directors and members > Subject: Re: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday > > Thanks Craig, but I'm planning on supporting our Houge Park > Public star party this Friday. > Maybe you folks can come up with another time that doesn't > conflict with our public star party. > > Rich From robhawley at earthlink.net Thu Feb 23 09:36:24 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday In-Reply-To: <20060223052948.55595.qmail@web53809.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: How late are we planning to stay? Rob Hawley From reade at batnet.com Thu Feb 23 12:58:02 2006 From: reade at batnet.com (Gordon Reade) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday In-Reply-To: <20060223052948.55595.qmail@web53809.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <143A1DF1-A4AF-11DA-A2F7-0003936961DA@batnet.com> Dear Craig That sounds really great. I?m looking forward to seeing you at Houge Park this Friday at 3:00 PM Clear Skies Gordon Reade On Wednesday, February 22, 2006, at 09:29 PM, Craig Scull wrote: > Greetings, > > You are invited to observe with me this friday at Bob > Ayers land. The purpose of the visit is to assess the > light domes, the potential near sources of light, to > otherwise give the site a "test run" and have a good time > under the stars. I'm also going to find out how > easy/difficult the road is to manage in a front wheel > drive VW stationwagon. > > We will meet at Houge Park at 3pm and leave by 3:15. > > Please let me know in advance if you would like to join > me. > > Why Friday? Bob has other obligations on Saturday that > prevent him from being able to observe. > > cheers > Craig > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of > stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created > by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. > www.greatvaluestores.com > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From craigus at rocketmail.com Thu Feb 23 17:24:37 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Observing from Ayers land this friday In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20060224012437.35166.qmail@web53807.mail.yahoo.com> 11 or Midnight sounds like a good time for me. I'm still getting over a bad flu, so I can't stay too late. --- Rob Hawley wrote: > How late are we planning to stay? > > > Rob Hawley > > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From robhawley at earthlink.net Sun Feb 26 17:38:36 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Trip Report to Ayer's site Message-ID: Craig, Lee, Gordon, and I went down to the Ayers' site on Friday to check out the light domes. From Ayers' flat the site is as dark or darker then the best sites I have observed at. It is darker then Plettstone (Michelle's site near Mariposa). While Glacier Point is higher, the lack of any visible lights allowed for complete dark adaptation. With the ridge in the background and NO lights south it is an incredible site. It is not quite as fantastic from other spots on the property, but it is still much darker then Fremont Peak and the most significant light dome is in the least important part of the sky. I took some photos to try to document the sky glow. All photos are about 4 minutes at ISO 800. I was planning to shoot long way vertical, but forgot. All images processed without an attempt to do any stretching. The N and S images most accurately represent what I saw at the site. So the south from Ayer's flat there is nothing. Note the single light. The transparency low to the south was not great Friday, but you can still clearly see the Pinnacles ridge. If I dramatically stretch the image then I can begin to see some sky glow from King City low on the horizon, http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/S%20from%20ayers%20flat_1.jpg To the north the Hollister sky glow is hidden by the ridge. This shot is to the N and NE. Polaris is easily visible as is a minor glow from the central valley. Notice by the time you get to Polaris the sky is black. http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/N%20from%20Ayers%20flat.jpg >From the ridge the sky glow from Hollister/Salinas is more visible. The clouds Friday tend to overemphasize the glow. Even here the glow did not extend more than 30 degrees into the sky. http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/NW%20from%20ridge.jpg >From the Ridge the glow in the central valley is more noticeable. From Ayer's flat the view east is similar to the view north http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/E%20from%20ridge_1.jpg Some other tid bits Bob does not currently lock the gate to his property. That is a little different then what I told the insurance company. There may be an issue with the ridge road being part of the general road easement. Someone added a lock to the W gate at the bottom of the ridge. Bob also removed a fence that was blocking the road near there. There was no evidence that someone has recently driven a car down to the W gate from the top of the ridge. It remains to see if there is an issue here. The road up was dry and quite easy to drive. Our fears concerning the ability to leave during the night were unfounded. We drove to the property in a variety of cars. There was a mild wind over the peak. It was not very cold Friday, but I can believe that this portion of the site could be as windy as FP or Coe. The seeing was outstanding. We were looking at Saturn at 318x with no problems. We could have increased the power, but I was too lazy to chase the image. Rob Hawley From robhawley at earthlink.net Sun Feb 26 17:40:08 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] RE: Trip Report to Ayer's site Message-ID: I forgot to mention that there was no evidence of sky glow to the west. The transparency there was not great, but I do not remember anything significant enough to take a picture. Rob Hawley From craigus at rocketmail.com Sun Feb 26 21:16:31 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Trip Report to Ayer's site In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20060227051631.16219.qmail@web53810.mail.yahoo.com> Great trip report! Those photos do a good job of showing what the sky glow (what little there is) looked like. Bob seemed to enjoy our visit and I appreciated the views he shared with me through his "tricked out" 6 inch Synta refractor. I had my best view ever of Barnard's loop! For the first time I could clearly follow the actual arc of nebulosity, whereas on prior visits to a lower elevation site at Willow Springs I barely detected something ill-defined and at the limit of visibility (even with H-beta) using a wide field 6 inch celestron reflector. The nebulosity around Merope in the Pleiades was also particularly easily observed. Not too shabby considering the transparency was what I would call "below average" judging by the amount of water vapor and/or dust I was seeing when I waived a white light LED flashlight over my head. Minor correction -- "Bob does not currently lock the gate to his property. That is a little different then what I told the insurance company." -- Bob may not always lock the gate, but it was his suggestion that we follow the PAIS and UACNJ (my old club back east) model of using a combination padlock as a way of restricting access. So your letter to the insurance company was correct in its description of a future state. Craig --- Rob Hawley wrote: > Craig, Lee, Gordon, and I went down to the Ayers' site > on Friday to check > out the light domes. From Ayers' flat the site is as > dark or darker then > the best sites I have observed at. It is darker then > Plettstone (Michelle's > site near Mariposa). While Glacier Point is higher, > the lack of any visible > lights allowed for complete dark adaptation. With the > ridge in the > background and NO lights south it is an incredible > site. > > It is not quite as fantastic from other spots on the > property, but it is > still much darker then Fremont Peak and the most > significant light dome is > in the least important part of the sky. > > I took some photos to try to document the sky glow. All > photos are about 4 > minutes at ISO 800. I was planning to shoot long way > vertical, but forgot. > All images processed without an attempt to do any > stretching. The N and S > images most accurately represent what I saw at the > site. > > So the south from Ayer's flat there is nothing. Note > the single light. The > transparency low to the south was not great Friday, but > you can still > clearly see the Pinnacles ridge. If I dramatically > stretch the image then I > can begin to see some sky glow from King City low on > the horizon, > http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/S%20from%20ayers%20flat_1.jpg > > To the north the Hollister sky glow is hidden by the > ridge. This shot is to > the N and NE. Polaris is easily visible as is a minor > glow from the central > valley. Notice by the time you get to Polaris the sky > is black. > http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/N%20from%20Ayers%20flat.jpg > > >From the ridge the sky glow from Hollister/Salinas is > more visible. The > clouds Friday tend to overemphasize the glow. Even > here the glow did not > extend more than 30 degrees into the sky. > http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/NW%20from%20ridge.jpg > > >From the Ridge the glow in the central valley is more > noticeable. From > Ayer's flat the view east is similar to the view north > http://home.earthlink.net/~robhawley/E%20from%20ridge_1.jpg > > > Some other tid bits > > Bob does not currently lock the gate to his property. > That is a little > different then what I told the insurance company. > There may be an issue > with the ridge road being part of the general road > easement. Someone added > a lock to the W gate at the bottom of the ridge. Bob > also removed a fence > that was blocking the road near there. There was no > evidence that someone > has recently driven a car down to the W gate from the > top of the ridge. It > remains to see if there is an issue here. > > The road up was dry and quite easy to drive. Our fears > concerning the > ability to leave during the night were unfounded. We > drove to the property > in a variety of cars. > > There was a mild wind over the peak. It was not very > cold Friday, but I can > believe that this portion of the site could be as windy > as FP or Coe. > > > The seeing was outstanding. We were looking at Saturn > at 318x with no > problems. We could have increased the power, but I was > too lazy to chase > the image. > > > Rob Hawley > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From robhawley at earthlink.net Sun Feb 26 23:42:23 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Driving time to the site Message-ID: When returning Friday I more carefully measured the mileage and driving time to the site. From my house in Almaden it is 80 miles and a little under 2 hours. That was obeying the speed limit the entire way. Rob Hawley From wb6yru at aenet.net Mon Feb 27 16:52:33 2006 From: wb6yru at aenet.net (Gary Mitchell) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] Friday's star party Message-ID: <44039ED1.5060308@aenet.net> I see our public star party got prominent mention in the Calendar section of Monday's Mercury News--even on the cover. Now if only we'd get good weather, which seems doubtful at this point. Gary From craigus at rocketmail.com Tue Feb 28 17:22:13 2006 From: craigus at rocketmail.com (Craig Scull) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] An update for the toilet In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20060301012213.33300.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings. I was not satisfied with the "no composting toilets" answer that the san benito county health department gave, because composting toilets are a more environmentally friendly option. They are also potentially (if not actually) more cost-effective. I asked my wife Elena, a former fundraiser and who used to share my board seat, to help us out. Elena's update follows-- Here's where we are on the Clivus feasibility project. (Clivus is a leading brand of composting toilet). It would be great if it could be a quick yes or no answer, but then few things in life are that simple. I called the the San Benito County office and was initially told we could not build a clivus in the area because of the CA Basin Plan. I pointed out that state parks have such structures and that they are very environmentally friendly at which point they directed me to the Building and Planning department and suggested I speak with a building inspector /planner who would go over the details of the lot and give us a more definite answer. The planner I spoke with needed more detailed information about the lot because I was told they look at the exact location, soil quality and flood possibility among other things. I was able to get the parcel number of the lot and with this information the planner begun her work researching all the information and calling the Environmental Health Office where she again was told that the CA Basin Plan did not allow a clivus in the area. I explained to her who the SJAA is and why we would prefer a clivus, and how a composting toilet actually seems much more environmentally friendly out in caw pasture land compared to a sceptic tank which is not as environmentally friendly a solution. She agreed whole-heartedly and told me that there may still be ways around this Basin Plan restriction. After all, state parks have clivus structers and the whole flood idea on which the CA Basin Plan is based on is really not an issue in our case since we are only talking about an 8' by 8' wooden structure with a composting toilet in the ground up on top of a mountain. So more research is pending and the planner will get back to me with some possible solutions. She was overall encouraging and said that there are generally ways to deal with these interdictions. An idea that she mentioned already was the possibility of dedicating the land (?) to get around the restriction --whatever that means. Basically we'll need to find a way to become exempt from the CA Basin Plan requirements. She will look into all the options that may be open to us and get back to me in about a week. Elena ------------------------------------------------------------- Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. www.greatvaluestores.com From rnapo at znet.com Tue Feb 28 17:33:51 2006 From: rnapo at znet.com (Rich N) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] An update for the toilet References: <20060301012213.33300.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002501c63cd0$325938d0$40f71345@180edt> Thanks very much, Elena! Rich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Scull" To: "Sjaaboard" Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 5:22 PM Subject: [SJAABoard] An update for the toilet > Greetings. I was not satisfied with the "no composting > toilets" answer that the san benito county health > department gave, because composting toilets are a more > environmentally friendly option. They are also > potentially (if not actually) more cost-effective. I > asked my wife Elena, a former fundraiser and who used to > share my board seat, to help us out. > > Elena's update follows-- > Here's where we are on the Clivus feasibility project. > (Clivus is a leading brand of composting toilet). It > would be great if it could be a quick yes or no answer, > but then few things in life are that simple. > > I called the the San Benito County office and was > initially told we could not build a clivus in the area > because of the CA Basin Plan. I pointed out that state > parks have such structures and that they are very > environmentally friendly at which point they directed me > to the Building and Planning department and suggested I > speak with a building inspector /planner who would go > over the details of the lot and give us a more definite > answer. > > The planner I spoke with needed more detailed information > about the lot because I was told they look at the exact > location, soil quality and flood possibility among other > things. I was able to get the parcel number of the lot > and with this information the planner begun her work > researching all the information and calling the > Environmental Health Office where she again was told that > the CA Basin Plan did not allow a clivus in the area. > > I explained to her who the SJAA is and why we would > prefer a clivus, and how a composting toilet actually > seems much more environmentally friendly out in caw > pasture land compared to a sceptic tank which is not as > environmentally friendly a solution. She agreed > whole-heartedly and told me that there may still be ways > around this Basin Plan restriction. After all, state > parks have clivus structers and the whole flood idea on > which the CA Basin Plan is based on is really not an > issue in our case since we are only talking about an 8' > by 8' wooden structure with a composting toilet in the > ground up on top of a mountain. > > So more research is pending and the planner will get back > to me with some possible solutions. She was overall > encouraging and said that there are generally ways to > deal with these interdictions. An idea that she mentioned > already was the possibility of dedicating the land (?) to > get around the restriction --whatever that means. > Basically we'll need to find a way to become exempt from > the CA Basin Plan requirements. She will look into all > the options that may be open to us and get back to me in > about a week. > > Elena > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Bring harmony to your home or office. Browse a wide selection of stunning wall fountains, floor fountains and tabletop fountains created by acclaimed artists. Discounted 30%. > www.greatvaluestores.com > > > _______________________________________________ > SJAABoard mailing list > SJAABoard@sjaa.net > http://www.sjaa.net/mailman/listinfo/sjaaboard > From robhawley at earthlink.net Tue Feb 28 18:38:59 2006 From: robhawley at earthlink.net (Rob Hawley) Date: Sat Sep 30 03:57:31 2006 Subject: [SJAABoard] An update for the toilet In-Reply-To: <20060301012213.33300.qmail@web53802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: That may be interesting from a number of perspectives. If we get the county to declare that this is a special astronomy site that may also help in our tax exemption discussions. A quick Google turned up a lot of references to cities and counties requiring developers to dedicate land for park use. We will just need to be careful in the event our Group 70 friends join us some day to make sure we don't do anything to exclude them. We also need to make sure that we don't agree to unrestricted public access to the land as that will violate a key provision in our proposed liability insurance. Let me know if you need me to talk paralegal with someone. Rob Hawley >> > So more research is pending and the planner will get back to > me with some possible solutions. She was overall encouraging > and said that there are generally ways to deal with these > interdictions. An idea that she mentioned already was the > possibility of dedicating the land (?) to get around the > restriction --whatever that means. > Basically we'll need to find a way to become exempt from the > CA Basin Plan requirements. She will look into all the > options that may be open to us and get back to me in about a week. > > Elena >